Baby_Sneak
Well-Known Member
Heck no, I want my matches to be of class, high lvl matches. But still, I feel it's kinda hard to make a solid stage list with a meta as undeveloped as this. But I'll DEFINITLY PM you though.
Tha Spark monthlies
- Thread starter Baby_Sneak
- Start date
If Sneak wants to do the latter I would like to do the former because:
A. I already run tourneys like those and
B. I would like a more competitive look at smash for my PR project.
Edit: AT THE SAME DAMN TIME! Anyways my first tournament had a turnout of almost 90 people (because people had no other things to do on New Years. Huh.) I was not prepared for this. Tourneys don't always turn out right the first time. You just need more experience as a TO.
That... just isn't true.
Hyrule Castle is a stage with permanent walls and is an overly large stage for 1v1 matches, allowing faster characters to avoid their opponent easily. Because of the layout, camping is also prominent issue. In fact... It's just recently been banned in 64 at Apex 2014. It's important to note that the original 64 version had a dangerous hazard, though that was NOT a singular reason for its ban, but it did contribute towards it (stalling and camping as well). Back to Minus; we have no outright "hazard", so this should be more viable, right? That would be true if it wasn't for one thing; infinites. It's possible to perform truly inescapable combos against the walls with our physics (a good example attack would be Fox's shine).
Delfino on the other hand, has been shown to be a competitively viable stage throughout Brawl's lifetime, occasionally seeing "starter" status in some lists. It has been banned in more conservative rulesets, but not for the points you're making (MK does so well there, and not many TOs wanted to buff his CP options). Now, it's true that portions of this stage have no "offstage", just floor. However, before we cry "BANNED", let's investigate it a little more closely. Why do we ban walk-offs? It's not because there's no offstage bit, it's because they can be abused in a way that "marginalizes player skill".
sunshade (via SWF) said:
In a walkoff's example, a player can simply camp at the edge of the screen, sheildgrab, and throw backwards to score extremely early KOs. It makes grabbing near the edges of the screen an extremely powerful strategy that makes the other skills you've earned take a back seat. The player camping can just sit there, and unless you've got a good projectile, then you have to approach him if you want the game to continue. So... BANNED, right? Well, no.
The above assumes that the stage in question has permanent walkoffs. In the case of Delfino, you're "touring" different layouts at a brisk rate; approximately every 30 seconds if memory serves. If somebody is trying to abuse the walkoffs, then they're unable to camp out the other player, since the constant transformations prevent any infinite stalling. The same goes for the walls; you must act within a specific time frame to be able to actually abuse them in a degenerative way, and even then, the other player can simply wait for the next transformation if they're afraid to approach. As such, their abusability is severely hindered, and we have a counterpick-worthy stage.
High-level play doesn't know the term "honor". Competitive players play to win, not to be honorable. If you truly want to win, then you can't box yourself in or hold back, unless there's specific rulings that you can NOT do X action.
PowerUp
Well-Known Member
Okay. If that's the general mood here, then can you give me a reason to participate in this community instead of the much larger and better developed P:M community that I just came from? Because I'm not seeing a difference other than this place being about a dozen players short of a ghost town.
I'm looking for a higher level of play than "try to out-exploit your opponent". I want opponents who can win with good reads and adaptability, not garden variety "I'm just taking advantage of the rules" tournament crawlers.
I was paraphrasing Sirlin's "Playing to Win". Pretty good read, that.
And most of us aren't really high-level (no offense to any of youse), but here simply because we enjoy having fun.
And most of us aren't really high-level (no offense to any of youse), but here simply because we enjoy having fun.
The reason is because that is literally the viewpoint of nearly every competitive player of anything ever. This is why wobbling is legal in melee(usually) or IC chaingrabs in Brawl are legal. Because at the epitome of gameplay they don't actually effect the game in an "unfair" manner. See Tybus's last post.
NEWB
Well-Known Member
Power, some of our most skilled players will play casually. Fight some of us for friendlies before you make that choice. The one thing minus does better than other mods is create a balanced game that is very fun, especially FFAs.
Though if you want a bigger community, may as well stick to pm if that is what you are used to. Last thing I'm gonna say about that is though we are few, we are all very active.
Though if you want a bigger community, may as well stick to pm if that is what you are used to. Last thing I'm gonna say about that is though we are few, we are all very active.
PowerUp
Well-Known Member
That article is lame, but to each his own. Look, I'm just trying to sort things out, and I'm getting mixed messages. Is this the kind of community where I will never set foot on Spear Pillar and constantly have to watch my back for infinites, or not? I've won enough games that winning doesn't really interest me anymore. In fact, I like to lose. I just want good matches. Good, as in: "wow, that guy read me like a book", not good as in: "wow, that guy can throw short hopped fairs all day long and he knows there's nothing I can do about it". Brawl- struck me as the kind of mod that supports a lot of variety and options...I was hoping the community would be the same way.
EDIT: saw your post, NEWB. I agree, FFA in this is amazing, and it's one of the reasons I'm drawn to it (teams are also great). I actually don't care about the size of a community. I'm just bored to death with the elitist attitude that dominates the smash community. You're right...it would be better to play some friendlies and judge for myself.
EDIT: saw your post, NEWB. I agree, FFA in this is amazing, and it's one of the reasons I'm drawn to it (teams are also great). I actually don't care about the size of a community. I'm just bored to death with the elitist attitude that dominates the smash community. You're right...it would be better to play some friendlies and judge for myself.
The Concept
Philosopher & Assassin
Have a match or two. That'll be all the proof you need.
Bashdemears
Jiggs2stronk
We have a neutral spear pillar. Just saying. Alot of the cast is about reading opponents. Some are more "entrapping." Either way, when we play serious. We play to win. Yes I will dthrow you with jiggs then chase with sing because you can't do jack squat about it.
I moved here from melee to here for the same reasons. Play friendlies in the chat, be social. It's a fun community. We're just serious for serious games, we like dicking around otherwise(Sneak can tell you about our legendary Sonic-Squirtle match on Hyrule64)
If there are true, unescapable infinites (a move or series of moves that can be used ad infinitum with no possible way to break out), then we take it upon ourselves as the developers to remove them.
They're also really boring imo.
Bashdemears
Jiggs2stronk
Dropping out because lack of wii
You couldn't find it?
Bashdemears
Jiggs2stronk
I'm gonna check the lost and found on Monday but if Its gone for eternity.. we all know I'd beat almost everyone in this thing.
Everyone thats not glyph, pin, gold, darx or kien
Everyone thats not glyph, pin, gold, darx or kien
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Lol^
