Brawl Minus 3.Q is all Qued up and ready to go!

[Tybis]

whatcha guys talkin bout I'm obv da bess
jk I get 3-stocked regularly on wifi

 

[Doqtor Kirby]

w0tchu say?
4-stocked every third game

 

[SunderStorm]

So I just played this patch in a 8-9 hour session with my friends.

• Sheik's whip is awesome. I did a midair whip into up-B for a KO. That was hilarious. Whip actually useful?! Blasphemy! Sakurai will have your soul! Castlevania whip indeed, all we need now is that signature flicking motion.
• Ike's Razing Eruption is pretty epic. It feels slightly out of place but this IS Brawl Minus so a thumbs up. Pretty much like all of his changes regarding NS. Though I would like to see Flourish link more consistently though. If I land that counter, and the enemy is right next to me, why should I have to worry about it basically fizzling for no good reason? Actually, it occurs to me that I never actually opted for this option in the entire session, since keeping the charge, Razing Eruption, or even Aether->Eruption were was so appealing. Assuming it still has linking problems as Bent says though, it doesn't really seem that appealing.
• Slightly sad about Peach nair nerf. As someone else mentioned, why not buff fair instead? I mean by numbers this change seemed pretty trivial anyways though, it's not like anything actually changed.
• Damn Link is a lot faster! Did he really need these buffs? I love how the Ending Blow is actually somewhat consistent now, great job on that!
• //Gripes about Firebrand. Apparently I didn't know it had armor! Still think it might just be *slightly* too slow though.
• Roy's ftilt with the increased endlag feels slightly clunky especially when compared to all of his other moves. It's no big deal though, as I guess it protects against cases of ftilt spam. I guess in the end I feel like I would prefer a more vanilla ftilt without endlag even if that meant losing some cool uniqueness. His airdash is amazing. I love the theme of all the FE lords having an aerial gapcloser that we have going on here.
• ROY'S FSMASH CHARGING ANIMATION IS SO COOL HOLY SHIT. HIS SIGNATURE BADASS CRIT! WHO MADE THIS CAN I THROW YOU 5 DOLLARS ON PAYPAL?
• I don't even play Zelda but even I can tell that her new dtilt is awesome.
• I don't really see any cases where I would rather opponents bounce rather than get grounded off Yoshi's fair, even with absurd hitstun.
• Diddy's new Final Smash is hilarious. If we're gonna add this in, might I suggest going ham with ALL of the final smashes? (Or at least patch Falcon a silly animation during his cutscene )

Cough

 

[NEWB]

Mario's aerial firebrand has armor.

 

[Thor]

Powerup = great Luigi? Must play him with Olimar... want to see how he handles the MU...

Gah so many Peeps to play! And these marshmallow chicks were challenging me earlier today too!

 

[Gold_TSG]

That is the best video ever, Sunder. That made my night.

 

[The Concept]

I like the falcon punch one.
I'm surprised they didn't do the one from Zeus.
It's just Cap.Falc running down the track, then he blows up.

 

[PowerUp]

Powerup = great Luigi? Must play him with Olimar... want to see how he handles the MU...

Unless I'm missing something, it's brutal in favor Olimar. Luigi cannot approach. Of course, I'm happy to try and find a way to break through!

 

[Kien]

ROY'S FSMASH CHARGING ANIMATION IS SO COOL HOLY SHIT. HIS SIGNATURE BADASS CRIT! WHO MADE THIS CAN I THROW YOU 5 DOLLARS ON PAYPAL?

That would be Thany. No idea where you can reach her though.

 

[DIjoe]

I play Olimar against Powerup' s character list a few times a month in person. Olimar does pretty well against luigi. your ability to wall him is very high, you just cant let luigi get started on you, bc as always his damage racking is very high.

 

[Tybis]

Don't forget Oli has super armor on downB... he could use that to jump through Luigi fireballs? He's already pretty small though.

 

[Thor]

I had figured it was awful, but some people were saying it's not that bad, and I was curious if maybe you could fight through the MU or knew some tricks to it. I guess not...

Anyone else feel maybe Luigi needs some kind of buff to help him out against Olimar a bit? No one else's Olimar MU is THAT bad...

 

[Neville]

There are some very polarizing matchups in Minus but can't think up of one off the top of my head right now. Any that you guys have seen?

 

[PowerUp]

I've found that Brawl- matchups come down to:

Mobility > Safe Approach >>>>> High Hit Stun > Projectiles > Disjointed Hitbox > Super Armor > Everything Else

Examples of terrible matchups:

Bowser vs Sonic - Bowser can't touch him at all because Sonic's extreme mobility allows him to keep Bowser in a constant state of hitstun and force him to attack, creating openings.

Ness vs Marth - Ness doesn't really have a leg to stand on, and can't handle the pressure Marth applies. He also has no off-stage play against one of the better spikers.

Peach vs Link - Peach's power is nowhere near KO'ing Link at a decent %. She is completely overwhelmed by his powerful projectile game, which shuts down her primary method of movement (hovering).

 

[NEWB]

Bowser v sonic isn't that bad. Abuse his armor and armor and he has less issue. Sonic is also pretty predictable.

 

[PowerUp]

Try Gold's.

 

[SunderStorm]

Back when Bowser had heavyarmor on everything, Bowser vs Pikachu was like 95-5 in favor of Bowser in my experience lol.

CF vs Bowser is pretty hard in favor of CF imo. CF has the speed to run circles around Bowser and Bowser is just straight up knee fodder.

 

[The Concept]

Who's a bad matchup against Pit?

 

[Neville]

Peach has issues against Marth too but not as bad as Link. As a Peach player I want to know; what characters counter Link? Also is there a matchup thread? If not then I'll go make one.

 

[PowerUp]

Your best bet against Link is Fox.

 

[DIjoe]

ya, a well played fox can rushdown link well enough. also reflector for the projectiles is nice.

 

[Pin Clock]

Peach has issues against Marth too but not as bad as Link. As a Peach player I want to know; what characters counter Link? Also is there a matchup thread? If not then I'll go make one.

There is a general match-up discussion, but no match-up specific threads like you'd find on Dustloop's forums.

 

[DIjoe]

So i just confirmed in person with powerup that olimar just hard counters luigi. Also, just started messing around with wolf and had a few questions.

1: does his forward air really only do 8%, put them in an unreachable spot, and have 0 kill pressure?
2: his Uair feels EXTREMELY weak as well.
3: so when you dont hit with the tip of his Fsmash it does 1-2% damage total
4: can he please just have another jump? lol

 

[NEWB]

What are you talking about? Wolf is absolutely amazing. His fair should pretty much combo into anything at low percent and more aerials at high percent, as well as up b. Always follow Uair with upb to finish the combo. I mean, that there is just a general rule of thumb. Uair CAN put them in position to do other things, but Uair into upb is his basic kill combo.

 

[Thor]

Beating Link? Lucario can combo him for days and has good movement, ROB can combo too and has a projectile game to match, Falco gives him problems with his own reflectors, better projectile in lasers, great spiking, and flexible recovery, and Olimar can play the walling game since the boomerang hits Pikmin (I believe) and they can act as dummies for the bombs and arrows at the right heights., while tacking damage or forcing the projectiles to stop while he knocks them off

Fox also has a fine time dealing with Link's projectiles, as does Zelda (and she can just kick him!). If you're good with Raptor Boost, Captain Falcon definitely has the combo power and can put in serious work against Link (the projectile immunity on Raptor Boost is why I mention him).

Jiggs can also weave around stuff if you're careful (or just duck) and has the gimping power of other characters on this list as well.

Not sure about the physical side of the MU, but if projectiles are your bane, these characters might just have the tools you need.