Brawl Minus 4.0b is here!
- Thread starter Pin Clock
- Start date
Lucis Perficio
Radiant Hero of Blue Flames
But Melee wasn't used as the basis of Project M. It was built off of Brawl, no?
Valravn
Well-Known Member
Exactly. Using an action replay or the 20XX mod, one can use the debug tools that HAL labs accidentally included on the disc. They didn't leave that in Brawl, so Magus had to build one himself with similar functions.
I'll probably put together an email about it tomorrow after work.
I'll probably put together an email about it tomorrow after work.
Mawootad
Minus Backroom
4GB+ SD cards are not compatible with hackless.
rezzollution
New Member
My card is 2GB but what is the hackless version? I don't believe I've seen that before.
Misaka Mikoto
New Member
The two different art links in the OP are actually the same URL, both to the BM artwork.
Can we have a link to the VB artwork package, please?
Pin Clock said:
Can we have a link to the VB artwork package, please?
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rezzollution
New Member
I was able to finally figure it out, thanks for the help!
Mariosonicman1
Well-Known Member
whelp. this better be in the next update. clearly this is worth holding off on all balancing, in hopes this gest programmed in.
Lucis Perficio
Radiant Hero of Blue Flames
It may still be a bit premature to ask, but considering it's been almost two months since the beta's been released, I'm assuming that most if not all mentions of bugs or balancing are being taken into consideration and that the team is doing their absolute best to perfect the game before calling it quits.
Would it be safe to assume that we'd see the finished version of the game by 2016?
ALSO, is there a complete, comprehensive changelist of ALL characters between vBrawl and 4.0b? The ssbwiki has the most changes I've seen and is by far the most comprehensive, but it's missing information on things like Ike having a hitbox at the top of his character model while charging an eruption started in the air.
Would it be safe to assume that we'd see the finished version of the game by 2016?
ALSO, is there a complete, comprehensive changelist of ALL characters between vBrawl and 4.0b? The ssbwiki has the most changes I've seen and is by far the most comprehensive, but it's missing information on things like Ike having a hitbox at the top of his character model while charging an eruption started in the air.
Bent 00
Longtime Limit Breaker
You mean Ragnell having a brief hitbox while charging Eruption aerially? Was that ever confirmed to be intentional or a bug?
Absolutely for certain 100% a bug that is going to be fixed
BeepBoopWAH
Wah, wah, HYUHH
Are there any stages yet planned for B- 4.0 Full when it has the Stage Expansion?
Thor
Well-Known Member
Random question... why do people seem obsessed with a cancel on Lucario down+B? Would it be wrong to only leave the walljump cancel [so you don't kill yourself... I think this one is perfectly justified] and then just leave as is [doesn't even need a sparkle]? Sure, it then has a fair bit of lag relative to most moves, but it's even better than Falcon Kick with invincible startup, an option to choose how you reappear after I-frames end, and considerable distance moved, more than Falcon Kick or Raptor Boost offer, and Falcon Kick was nearly nerfed while Raptor Boost was.
Maybe Kien is convinced it's too laggy or something, but... this would seem an easy solution... we've been discussing what cancel to give it, but did we ever question if it needs a cancel while grounded at all???
Bent 00
Longtime Limit Breaker
Not sure if you're being sarcastic here or not, but actually, now is the time for such polish. Since 4.0 will be the final version, it's now or never.
I hope the devs will take as much time as they need to polish up 4.0 as much as possible. Take a whole year if you want to -- just finish the less-important stuff that has been left on the back burner for so long, before you quit. Stuff like CPU AI, taunts (SNAAAKE), menus, extra modes, etc.
Gold_TSG
Can't stop The Dorf Train.
I don't think it needs a cancel at all. It's easily the most abusable and versatile counter in the game, so why does it need to be better? Why not just throw cancels on everyone's counters so no one char is getting special treatment they don't deserve for a move that is supposed to COUNTER ATTACKS.
Gold_TSG
Can't stop The Dorf Train.
Have you ever vanilla Lucario'd before? It is supposed to be a counter, just like Marth, Ike, and Roy. Someone decided to change it for no reason other than to make Lucario not have a counter, which led to this nonsense that everyone has been complaining about for well over a year. Why should he be the only one to have a not-counter?
Valravn
Well-Known Member
I know it's supposed to be a counter in vBrawl, I was pointing out that it didn't seem like much of a counter now.
I actually really like how Lucario can go balls to the walls in the air with his up-b and down-b-not-counter thing, but he still has his limits compared to a lot of the cast. (I've accidentally murdered myself with a not-counter in the wrong direction more than a few times.) I personally think the move is fine, and have only heard complaints about it recently.
What do you think is wrong with it, and what would you envision as a good change?
I actually really like how Lucario can go balls to the walls in the air with his up-b and down-b-not-counter thing, but he still has his limits compared to a lot of the cast. (I've accidentally murdered myself with a not-counter in the wrong direction more than a few times.) I personally think the move is fine, and have only heard complaints about it recently.
What do you think is wrong with it, and what would you envision as a good change?
Gold_TSG
Can't stop The Dorf Train.
Oh I've gone on many rants on how I don't like it, and how it offers very little counter play. The fact that it is instant, can be directed, and is basically invincible makes it very powerful. Having a cancel on it is entirely unnecessary because of this. The jump cancel prior to the grab cancel made it nigh unbeatable, as you could use it over and over with pretty much no penalty whatsoever.
The grab cancel is stupid because it's just some lame excuse to "make up for the loss of the jump cancel" or something to that degree, which is nonsense logic. If it isn't going to be changed back into a regular counter, it needs the removal of any form of cancel on it, seeing as the move is powerful enough without it as a quick, surprise attack or a get-out-of-combo-free utility.
It deserves to have the endlag on it when used because there is no sound reason to cancel it. Learn to use it properly, and it can be extremely useful to you. Don't make it easy-mode just cause you can't handle the slowness of the endlag.
The grab cancel is stupid because it's just some lame excuse to "make up for the loss of the jump cancel" or something to that degree, which is nonsense logic. If it isn't going to be changed back into a regular counter, it needs the removal of any form of cancel on it, seeing as the move is powerful enough without it as a quick, surprise attack or a get-out-of-combo-free utility.
It deserves to have the endlag on it when used because there is no sound reason to cancel it. Learn to use it properly, and it can be extremely useful to you. Don't make it easy-mode just cause you can't handle the slowness of the endlag.
Lucis Perficio
Radiant Hero of Blue Flames
Thats unfortunate. Considering the holes in Ike's super armor while charging and releasing Eruption when struck from below, it was nice that he had an advantage while charging otherwise. It made Eruption more characteristically like a volcano, which I thought made sense.
Also can I get an answer as to what my actual concerns are? I got a response relatin to the example I gave for my true concerns, but not my actual concerns mentioned above which were 90% of my message... lol
We're currently unsure when the final version of Brawl Minus is going to be released. As others have stated earlier, we wish to take our time to make the final version of our mod to be the best we possibly can.
While we try to keep track of as many changes as we can, we have lost most of the changelogs for the earliest versions of Minus. But since 4.0 will be the final version of the game, we will make a vBrawl>Brawl Minus 4.0 changelog, either before the release or after it.
Thor
Well-Known Member
One of the most important things to note about Lucario "counter" is that it is actually [if what I've been told is correct] the best combo-breaker in Minus... I was told it's invincible frame 1, so if that's true, it's not only faster than even mashing airdodge would be if you could airdodge out of tumble, but you can't airdodge out of tumble, meaning it's the only way to become invincibile without either wiggling out of tumble and airdodging or burning a jump and airdodging [which are both still slower].
As Falco, to try to avoid followups I sometimes mash jump and dodge and will avoid a followup [useful notably against ROB's laser if he isn't quick in using it after a strong hit], but Lucario and just mash down+B to achieve the same effect... while still controlling what direction he moves afterward AND getting a hitbox after the invincibility, something mashing jump+airdodge can't match.
I honestly wouldn't mind a jump-cancel ON HIT if the point of the cancel was to extend Lucario's offensive game [that is, make it some sort of whack but cool combo extender], but the JC is way too safe and the grab cancel makes shielding it less effective [not sure, but I think JC side+B didn't work to grab people who shielded it]. As it stands now, the move is just basically among the best in the game [it rivals Sheik's 3.Q vanish in terms of safety and ease of use].
EDIT: Also, I personally think counter shouldn't be a kill move... sure, countering a lot is annoying, but dying to counter at like 110% is SUPER annoying... reduce the KBG and divorce the move from aura if we want it balanced, ESPECIALLY if it keeps the cancels [although if it combos into stuff then... that only sort of fixes the issue...]
As Falco, to try to avoid followups I sometimes mash jump and dodge and will avoid a followup [useful notably against ROB's laser if he isn't quick in using it after a strong hit], but Lucario and just mash down+B to achieve the same effect... while still controlling what direction he moves afterward AND getting a hitbox after the invincibility, something mashing jump+airdodge can't match.
I honestly wouldn't mind a jump-cancel ON HIT if the point of the cancel was to extend Lucario's offensive game [that is, make it some sort of whack but cool combo extender], but the JC is way too safe and the grab cancel makes shielding it less effective [not sure, but I think JC side+B didn't work to grab people who shielded it]. As it stands now, the move is just basically among the best in the game [it rivals Sheik's 3.Q vanish in terms of safety and ease of use].
EDIT: Also, I personally think counter shouldn't be a kill move... sure, countering a lot is annoying, but dying to counter at like 110% is SUPER annoying... reduce the KBG and divorce the move from aura if we want it balanced, ESPECIALLY if it keeps the cancels [although if it combos into stuff then... that only sort of fixes the issue...]
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