Stages of Brawl Minus

[The Concept]

That's an option. I see it as a reasonable one. Can a dev prove Bent and I wrong?

Addition:
Doq....I don't see that code anywhere, yet I can still pick all my stages on Random. Here are the codes I use in my custom build for custom SSS

Spoiler

Classic Expansion SSS v5.3
* 046B8F5C 7C802378
* 046B8F64 7C6300AE
* 040AF618 5460083C
* 040AF68C 38840002
* 040AF6AC 5463083C
* 040AF6C0 88030001
* 040AF6E8 3860FFFF
* 040AF59C 3860000C
* 060B91C8 00000018
* BFA10014 7CDF3378
* 7CBE2B78 7C7D1B78
* 2D05FFFF 418A0014
* 006B929C 00000027
* 066B99D8 00000027
* 00010203 04050709
* 080A0B0C 0D0E0F10
* 11141516 1A191217
* 0618132A 1D1E1B1C
* 2B2C2D2E 2F303100
* 006B92A4 00000026
* 066B9A58 00000026
* 1F202122 23242526
* 27283233 34353637
* 38393A3B 3C3D3E3F
* 40414243 44454647
* 48494A4B 4C4D0000
* 06407AAC 0000009C
* 01010202 03030404
* 05050606 07070808
* 0909330A 0B0B0C0C
* 0D0D0E0E 130F1410
* 15111612 17131814
* 19151C16 1D171E18
* 1F19201A 211B221C
* 231D241E 251F2932
* 2A332B34 2C352D36
* 2F373038 3139323A
* 2E3BFFFF 40204121
* 42224323 44244525
* 46264727 48284929
* 4A2A4B2B 4C2C4D2D
* 4E2E4F2F 50305131
* 523D533E 543F5540
* 56415742 58435944
* 5A455B46 5C475D48
* 5E495F4A 604B614C
* 624D634E 00000000

Stage Roster Expansion System v2.0: [Phantom Wings]
* E0000000 80008000
* 04043B20 380000FF
* 04043B40 1C060018
* 04043B58 38840018
* 04949C8C 3884B460
* 04949D10 3884B460
* 04949E20 3884B460
* 04949EFC 3884B460
* C294A588 00000003
* A063001A 2C030040
* 41800008 38600000
* 60000000 00000000
* C294A1D0 00000003
* 7C7D1B78 2C03FFFF
* 40820008 3FA0003F
* 60000000 00000000
* 04015564 48000010
* 2042AEB0 00000041
* 0442AEB0 00000000
* 80000000 8042AEB0
* 80000001 8042AEB0
* 60000030 00000000
* 8A001801 00000000
* 86000000 00000024
* 86000001 00000018
* 62000000 00000000
* 0042B348 024B0000
* 0442B348 00000040
* 0642B34C 00000010
* 73745F63 7573746F
* 6D00002E 72656C00
* 80000000 8042BC18
* 80000001 8042B460
* 8A010001 00000000
* 0442B560 8042BC14
* 0042BC18 010F0000
* 0642BC14 00000008
* 43757374 6F6D0000
* E0000000 80008000
* 04043B34 483E783C
* 0642B370 00000050
* 2C060031 4080000C
* 80040000 48000040
* 3806000F 7C030000
* 40820030 3866FFD0
* 38C4000F 38860001
* 3CA08042 60A5B450
* 38E00000 7E6802A6
* 4BFCB811 7E6803A6
* 38C00031 4BC1878C
* 3884FFE8 4BC1877C
* 04949C88 4BAE1749
* 04949D0C 4BAE16C5
* 04949E1C 4BAE15B5
* 04949F08 4BAE14C9
* 0642B3D0 00000060
* 9421FF80 BC610010
* 7C6802A6 9061000C
* 2C000040 41800030
* 7C030378 3863FFC1
* 3CC08042 60C6BC1C
* 38860001 3CA08042
* 60A5B450 38E00000
* 39200000 4BFCB7AD
* 38000040 540013BA
* 8061000C 7C6803A6
* B8610010 80210000
* 4E800020 00000000
* 0042B455 00000078
* 0442B45C 00000002

The rest of my SSS expansion system codes are all music related.

 

[Lightning]

Actually, I have the stage expansion, random works fine, and added stages can be selected through random.

 

[The Concept]

Me too, Lightning. I don't have the code Doqtor Kirby has shown me. I've shown my codes.
Lightning, you've played my build once. Do you remember if you could random all the stages?
I'll run some tests to double check, but I'm pretty sure of myself.

 

[Lightning]

Me too, Lightning. I don't have the code Doqtor Kirby has shown me. I've shown my codes.
Lightning, you've played my build once. Do you remember if you could random all the stages?
I'll run some tests to double check, but I'm pretty sure of myself.

I can comfirm this on my custom build. I don't use your build.

 

[Kien]

I get random freezes on random every now and then regardless of what codes I use. I don't feel that the stages was ever the issue.

 

[PowerUp]

Can we bring back shadow moses? Green smashville with ghosts isn't doing it for me.

 

[Kien]

Green Smashville with ghosts?

 

[The Concept]

1. I think he means...Lavender Town??
2. Shadow Moses is gone? I haven't noticed.

 

[Thor]

Definitely means Lavender Town. Or else I managed to nearly instantaneously translate "Green Smashville with ghosts" incorrectly, which would be quite impressive.

I'd personally rather see Norfair- over Shadow Moses Island, but I admit I'm not exactly a fan of Lavender Town either. It feels really small (but I guess playing Falco makes me biased toward larger stages, even though I do like Metal Cavern...).

 

[Kien]

What do Lavender Town and Shadow Moses have in common?

 

[Doqtor Kirby]

Hazards.

 

[The Concept]

....where are the hazards in Shadow Moses?
The walls breaking? The walls respawning?
Those aren't hazards....
When the Halberd machines attack you...those are hazards.

 

[Tybis]

Yo what's up guys.

If you ask me, that's not a good reason for excluding the Stage Expansion code. Who picks Random that often anyway? Use a random number generator, roll some dice, or draw a number out of a hat. The extra stages are worth it.

That sounds like a very poor trade-off to me. "Hey, if you want a random stage from a list, then you're gonna have to jump through some extra hoops instead using the built-in feature!"

That's an option. I see it as a reasonable one. Can a dev prove Bent and I wrong?

Um.... who's proving what now? I'm confused.

About that code. It makes all stages selectable via Random, but breaks Random Stage Select. If you use the Stage Expansion pack, but not that code, Random Stage Select will work normally for the default stage slots, but the added slots will never get picked. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that's how it works. What's your excuse for not taking this route? You could put all your Tournament-legal stages in the original 41 slots.

That is how it works. Our "excuse"? Let me make a hypothetical; You have a list of 41 stages in your Random Stage Switch, with a number of stages that aren't selectable outside of random. You think that stage X should be legal (or maybe it's one of your favorites), and therefore in the Random. However, stage X is an added stage via the SEP, and can never be random-d.

The logical answer to this would simply be to move stage X into the Random by swapping its slot with another stage, right? Well... no. That may work for YOU (not anyone in specific), but not for other players with differing views/tastes on stages, who may think that stage X is garbage.

I could elaborate more on this, but I think I'll instead suggest what could potentially remedy our issue of wanting stages, yet not wanting to ruin anybody's time. I haven't been able to test this myself, so I'll need help verifying if anybody has tried it out;
Assuming an SEP stage is not selected, then is it possible to have WiFi matches between an SEP build of Minus and a non-SEP build, without the matches desynching? Or, not desynching any more than they do already?

Green smashville with ghosts isn't doing it for me.

That's offensive to ghosts and the color green.

Shadow Moses is gone? I haven't noticed.

Neither have I... and I'm the stage guy! How'd that happen???

 

[The Concept]

Yes, Tybis. Based on my understanding of stages and the SEP, that should be fine, but one would have to be extra sure that the non SEP stages are identical to each other, like always.
However, some, not me, may think it a hassle to have to be careful of what stage they pick though. I think it's a good idea.

 

[Thor]

Yo what's up guys.

That sounds like a very poor trade-off to me. "Hey, if you want a random stage from a list, then you're gonna have to jump through some extra hoops instead using the built-in feature!"

The current trade-off is "Hey guys, a few of us like Random, so we're dramatically reducing the stage list and having to cut/not add popular stages because we don't want to jump through extra hoops to have like 40% more places to fight in-game."

Or maybe view it as "We'd like to cut a whole bunch of content in gameplay to make a feature of the menu work right, because one button working properly in the menu is more important than adding variety/awesomeness to the gameplay."

The trade-off you highlight seems significantly better than the ones I've noted.

 

[The Concept]

Keep in mind, Thor, that the forum members are not the only ones who enjoy Brawl Minus.
Who is speaking for them? No one, yet they do matter just as much as we do.
It is my understanding that we want more people to come to Minus. If so, then to me it makes more sense to limit stages, than to have a broken random feature that can potentially push people away. Minus is broken, but not that kind of broken.
The best plan would be to have the extra stages, with a working random feature. If you want an example of an active member who uses Random: me and my local group, and possibly others.
I will also say that I've never experienced a freezing with Random stage select, both in official Minus 3.3 and in my custom, which both use different codes, it seems.
I'd really like to see the extra stages return, and I would like to help with the process of finding a solution.

 

[The Concept]

Also....Shadow Moses isn't gone....

 

[Tybis]

Also....Shadow Moses isn't gone....

Even if it was, it'll always be in my heart.

 

[Darxmarx]

Is minus ever gonna get their own custom fd and battlefield? We really should.

Like how PM has their own FD? That depends. What would it even be? PM's was a no-brainer, because it's just Melee's platform with some texture swapping for the BG. I guess a Minus one would need to be completely original, or a more extreme version of Brawl's... but I'm not really sure what that would look like.
If you have ideas though, be sure to share em.

For the sake of keeping things clean though, I'd suggest continuing this FD discussion in the stage thread.

7 Destination plz
thx @Doqtor Kirby

Warning: Do not watch if bright light offends you physically or mentally

 

[NEWB]

Oh dear god... That stage screws with me eyes 0.0

I'm not sure of I hate it or not.

 

[Bashdemears]

Here's an idea:

Do what PM did and put all the competitive stages one one page. Neutrals up top, CP's on bottom. Then put all the wacky stages on the second page.

 

[NEWB]

They were doing that with stage expansion. That may or may not comeback, so it would be kinda pointless to try and make it work without stage eansion when it already works with stage eansion.

That is assuming they can get stage expansion to work with the turning on and off random stage function.

 

[NEWB]

The only difference for Minus' FD is the collision data.
If that's the case, then you could just import Minus' ModelData100, collisions, and STPM (the camera) into this new FD, and it should work without desynching... I think?.

So what specificly am I importing to the smash 4 FD?

 

[Vauss]

Can I put in a vote to completely get rid of or change Final Frustration? That stage actually gives me motion sickness

 

[Doqtor Kirby]

Can I put in a vote to completely get rid of or change Final Frustration? That stage actually gives me motion sickness

Don't play on it then.
What's the point of getting rid of Pichu's home stage?