Samus

[13131]

anyone else feel like the change to her fair and bombs resulted in a nerfed character?

i miss the old moves. these bombs very rarely hit. too much warning. can make an opponent back off (maybe), but that is about it.

the fair, though amazing for horizontal recovery, is very difficult to follow. her combo potential is lacking without the old, all-purpose, backwardsandforwards upanddown fair...

waah.

 

[Glyph]

Completely agree. Maybe its just because of how used I was to the old Fair but the new one never really found much utility in my play, and when it did it didn't feel all that satisfying for some reason. The recovery buff is nice, but looking back at my samus games I can't say there were all that many instances where I would have needed the Fair to recover anyway.

Just one of those things where I'm sure someone could pick it up and make it amazing, but that person is not me.

 

[13131]

certainly possible. but maybe too difficult. an extremely well-timed grab and throw at a couple of power bombs might actually result in the unlikely 20% damage. but usually the opponent retreats and spams projectiles while you take half an hour to come out of your morph ball.

forward air travels too far to be followed, and if you try to hit with the end of the move it's simply avoided. it almost always ends up being the last hit of a combo... it's just not as versatile as the old fair.


sigh.

i would argue samus has returned to low tier. but this is the wrong thread.

 

[Tybis]

i would argue samus has returned to low tier. but this is the wrong thread.

Not really. If you think it's because of the changes done to her then I think it goes here.
Not sure if I agree that she's low tier, but she's certainly not top.

There's a lot of fun to be had with new Samus... but at the same time, she's lost her other options. Max Fair is useful, but so was old Fair. Same thing with the Morph Bomb. Pretty undeniable how useful Dtilt is now though. That thing is abusable.

 

[Glyph]

I'm still really confused why we don't have old Fair on tap and new Fair on hold. Solves all the problems, makes everyone happy, and its not like it makes Samus super broken.


...right?

 

[Kien]

I'm still really confused why we don't have old Fair on tap and new Fair on hold. Solves all the problems, makes everyone happy, and its not like it makes Samus super broken.


...right?

I was just about to say we could probably do that. I think her old fair could use a buff though, and that her Up B should work like her fair currently does. A single powerful hit. It's just kind of lame to see that her Uair and up B hit the same way. Also, I don't imagine it would be terribly hard to speed up her exit from power bombing, as well as the detonation timer on the bombs. Currently, you have just enough time to grab and upthrow them right into the bomb assuming you didnt move.

 

[Tybis]

I'm still really confused why we don't have old Fair on tap and new Fair on hold. Solves all the problems, makes everyone happy, and its not like it makes Samus super broken.


...right?

Well... considering the really low startup of both of those Fairs, I'd imagine your reaction time would have to be extremely on-point to perform the move you want 100% of the time.
Or revert Fair and have it be an alt UpB. It'll make more sense that way.

 

[NEWB]

THANK YOU! I brought this up a long time ago when she first entered beta, but no one agreed with me then, probably cuz it was new. I've even already suggested those things. I'm happy I'm not the only one that thinks that samus is kinda worse off then she was pre max.

The tricky thing about samus is she either needs old downb or new fair. She can't lose both of those. Correct me if I'm wrong, but she can't really bomb jump to recover anymore, so that's why she got new fair. I really want old fair, but that would require that something is moved to tap input or alt input.

 

[Queso2469]

On a slightly different note, what about holding B to get a bomb jump timer on the new bombs? It would be a way to keep one of the more unique elements on vanilla samus.

 

[13131]

it just doesn't make sense that 2.x samus is superior to max samus.

anyway

 

[13131]

or an earlier interruptible frame on new fair..
idunno.

 

[NEWB]

The problem I feel with samus is that her new moves appear to have taken away from her more than they added.

I feel her new physics have nerfed her air game. I don't know about others, but I can't even do air combos anymore. Nair used to combo with itself and dair in 2.6. I think they still do, but the new physics make it harder now. Maybe I can't get the timing for the current build.

Her old down b was a recovery option and a disruptive tool. Now, I'm not even sure how its used, so it basically does nothing because people cant get it to hit. It mostly took away from her game.

Her homing missiles don't hit foes up any more like in 2.6. Now they kinda disrupt, but before you could combo with them. I would use homing missiles to bring people over empty space close to me so I could spike with sair. It true combos, but not anymore. The bulky, fast missiles lost the ice attack that created more shield pressure. That was removed entirely. I don't know if that was broken though.

New fair is now a recovery because she lost her down b recovery, but unlike old fair, new fair leaves samus open because the attack sends her at the foe. Old fair could be offensive or defensive, so its a better move overall. It was also pretty cool.

That's is what happened to her. New stuff that actually are nerfs across the board.

 

[13131]

100% accurate.
far as i can tell, and i do play a lot of Samus.

v2 Samus was what got me into minus. this samus feels more like vbrawl. except that she can KO eventually.. and some other perks, to be fair. but... hmm..
well
a lot of other fun characters to play!......

sigh.

oh, i should read the thread posts more carefully.

yes, please, better bombs and fair. thank you.

 

[Kien]

The problem with Samus (supposedly) is that she has to be Hexed. Which Thunda knows how to do and possibly Numbuh. I never learned it though. Of course I'll be leaving him this feedback though. Having Samus mains not like Samus sucks.

 

[13131]

it's only a few things that disrupt the flow of her attacks and her overall game. she seems slowed down a bit too.. but comparing her to vbrawl Samus was excessive. she's still far better than that.

i just wish i wasn't so late to the beta. having just discovered minus (2.x) was pretty distracting.

 

[13131]

so uh what is samus up to these days?

 

[NEWB]

Still adjusting to the functions of new fair. Still worse as far as I can tell, but who knows? I don't experiment with it for long periods of time.

 

[13131]

samus herself is unmaxed, perhaps power suit samus should be reverted..

just saying.

 

[Sammi-husky]

I feel like since the beta, samus' changes made her more weak in the air, regardless of her new f-air. i think giving her the old one with a new input or something would giver her more options, especially if they want to hit the opponent but not go flying forward ala new f-air.

 

[NEWB]

There is that, and all the other thing I mentioned. That's a huge one since it leaves her vulnerable. That and her now useless homing missiles. And her non bomb jumping never hitting down b. I wish her new down b was better somehow. I'd hate to lose all her new stuff, but she needs her old stuff back as well.

 

[Sammi-husky]

maybe make it so each stock, she has a timer. and once the stock timer reaches a certain point, button combo to change her moves to phazon mode for a certain amount of time. where her moveset changes to be more powerful and cool and stuff. but ONLY for a short period of time.

OR just a button combo to change to phazon mode for a short time, but only once per stock sounds AWESOME to me. lol

 

[13131]

i'm finding some uses for the fair outside of a little recovery help. if it could be canceled earlier it could be a better combo tool.

the old bombs were weaker, but actually did damage and could get things started. if there wasn't so much lag... and time..

 

[Kien]

What about replacing Samus' Nair with her Screw Fair and giving the old Fair back? There's literally no reason to sex kick when you can approach with equal KO power and safety that doubles as a recovery.


Then the old fair could be edited so that you can hold the button down to not stop blasting.
So, you hold A and she keeps shooting flames from one direction but when you let go she finishes the move with the arcing swing.

 

[NEWB]

Man... Old samus could do SO many Nair combos.... This move wasn't a kill move ever so much as it was a combo tool. My favorite was Nair Nair and dair. This worked very well at mid percents, but short hopping gives her less air time now and makes this hard to do.

Glad to hear that she is being looked at again... I think. I want to marry old samus with new samus somehow, but they are so different. Normaly I'm all on for minus' redone Movesets, but old samus was so much stronger than new samus.

If you are going that route, maybe keep current Nair at tap input and new fair over Nair as normal input???

 

[NEWB]

I really like the sound of that edit to old Nair. Sounds awesome.