In Brawl Minus MAX, Meta Knight was a powerful force with a unique gimmick: He didn't deal that much damage, but had a lot of knockback, netting him kills at percents far earlier than anyone else would. However, this was rather unfair in teams where MK paired with anyone decent at dishing out damage was a dangerous force to stop. His percents and KB were altered since then, but at the same time he lost some of his touch, power, and uniqueness.
As shown in the 4.0 preview changelog, we were considering returning Meta Knight to a variation of his MAX self. However, this decision was met with more questionable feedback, so this thread was created as a place to talk about how MK should be handled in 4.0.
While I'm at it, I'll bring up a few other topics in here too:
Meta Knight's jab, which allowed him to get away from most confrontations and reward him with a combo if it hit. It's better than HIYIYA but is it the best jab for him?
Meta Knight's fSmash is completely out of synch with the rest of his moves. It's very slow and very powerful, as well as his best kill move. That aside, it's also clunky, can be easily countered, and has confusing endlag. What ideas would you have to better this move?
MK's uSmash is also "clunky" in a sense. It's really good for aerial set ups, but lacks an end animaiton (which we have a hard time actually adding ourselves). What do you think of Meta Knight's uSmash?
Any other thoughts about Meta Knight, please share them here!
I do not like MAX MK, as I found playing him annoying, since unlike a lot of characters you actually couldn't gimp effectively at low percents [Ganondorf can land a pair of stomps as can Falcon, Falco can do zillions of offstage dairs and use the flames of fire bird to irritate the opponent, Pikachu's got thunder and dair, etc.] which is odd since I feel like MK is an offstage flier. I feel with his current form he's a tiny bit better at that, which feels truer to how I think MK should play.
MK's jab is safe on shield, rewards him with a combo if hit, can chain into itself in silly ways [jab -> jab -> jab anyone? How about jab -> dsmash -> walk forward and jab again? Or jab -> grab if bad enough DI...]. It's amazing, but I have to wonder if it's well-designed.
Perhaps make his old ftilt his new jab, and make a new ftilt??? [This felt worth underlining.]
MK's fsmash is barely stronger than dsmash [it feels that way], and I HATE the endlag on it. I'd prefer vBrawl fsmash with maybe a small KB boost if this one is stronger than vBrawl's, but it doesn't have to be a lot since that one is safer.
Usmash feels awkward to combo with to be honest, and it looks a little weird. I liked old usmash for being decent at eating airdodges to be honest [as rarely used as it was]. It had some other uses too that I felt may have not been that well-explored, since in Brawl the lack of hitstun made it almost useless for following up as compared to ftilt, utilt the stronger not SDIable KO move, or just nado for the same or more damage on most targets. In Brawl Minus I felt his usmash could have had uses as it was, or even just make it JC-able at the end if you want similar functionality while being smoother [though this might be too good and/or just lazy].
I also wish dsmash sent in the normal vBrawl directions - I never understood why it was changed to always send the direction he's facing, and I preferred it being able to send opponents behind you back out. If there's a reason for this I wouldn't mind hearing it to evaluate it, but right now I find this both annoying and confusing.
Honestly, I really don't know. It seems like what has been done to him has made him better than before.
Low damage and high knockback are unique but that is overpowered in team matches. If that can't be remedied somehow, that seems like a bad idea.
I've never liked his new attacks as far as coolness goes. I can't argue against them because they have greater utility then vbrawl versions but the vbrawl moves were much cooler imo. When I first saw MK in braw., I instantly wanted to main him because he swings his sword at like 90 mph! I mean, I guess faster than that since he can apparently make a tornado.... The new moves have greater utility but they have never clicked well with me because they feel like they don't fit.
His old jab looks awesome but sucks mostly. New jab has utility but is basically an attack attached to back roll, making back roll pretty much useless. That's kinda stupid visually and it didn't really feel creative since it is just an attack attached to back roll making back roll useless. If MK becomes a high knockback character then he doesn't really need combos either.
Old Fsmash had a little more power then dsmash but Dsmash just outclasses it with speed and it covers more options. MK didn't need his fsmash, so he got slower, stronger new fsmash. I don't mind this move at all and could stay as is. It's been said that not all attacks need to be super useful. BUT all his attacks will be gaining knockback, netting him more kills if the new change is applied. This makes this attack slightly less useful unless it's turned into a falcon punch type move. I'm guessing the endlag is confusing because he finishes the attack with the end of his fight me taunt. Either remove that altogether or only make it do that if the fsmash connects.
Speaking of taunts, MK having voice clips sprinkled throught his moveset was freaking awesome. He was that much more a total boss. I say put those back in.
His old Usmash was changed simply in favor for a combo starter I guess. I don't really see a problem with his vbrawl Usmash though. Mind you, his new Usmash replaced his last new usmash, which was basically just the first swing of vbrawl Usmash and he was instantly in the air just barely off the ground. That didn't do anything. If MK becomes a high knockback character, he wouldn't need combos actually.
Those are my thoughts. I'd like his jab and his Usmash to be played around with but the fsmash is mostly fine as is.
I think backroll is still useful because of invincibility against people landing from above. It's much better than backroll for avoiding a grab after an aerial though [or usually as good], which is kind of silly.
I think dsmash is better than current fsmash. I think old fsmash was a lot safer and had more range, so I liked it [and with the nearly non-existent endlag and high hitbox, begged people to challenge it, and served as a great anti-air in some situations]. I just feel the current one is awkward and doesn't really give much reward to MK for landing it.
His old new fsmash was really weird - I never did much with it but I don't know if that's all that good.
