Cool/useful things Snake can do in Minus?

[Xentas]

Not required to be anything serious, just... Things he can do. Techniques he can pull off.

Did anyone know that side or up grab + C4 + fullcharge mine (both on a platform, can up b for cypher, down b to cancel the cypher and send out a c4) can equal 50% damage and/or instasmash for Snake? You can pull it off on most courses if done correctly, and you can even upsmash after doing it, or use an upsmash to launch the opponent instead for extra power (Bowser can be very victim of this). It has trouble on the smallest characters if you use it on an up throw (grabs can be annoying for those chars), but it's a glee to do it and I've found can work well. Works even at 30%-50%, hard to execute. I also find that mines are useful finishers to combos too.

 

[Bent 00]

Pin confirmed that Snake is done "for the most part". IIRC, some dev said he was a pain to PSA...

Anyhow, he's just fine as-is balance-wise. IMO, the only things Snake needs are new taunts, and to lose the turbo fist pump on Nikita.

 

[Xentas]

I was just asking some techniques he can do that I might not know. I don't think he's any less fair of a player then Bowser, and his attacks work perfectly well. This wasn't about balance, I was keeping those arguments on the 4.0 thread.

Snake is the box. I enjoy KO'ing an opponent and saying "I am THE BOX" after doing the taunt, lol. He needs something silly, like a finger/dart pistol joke (dart pistol could be taken from PM?) or the fist pump as a taunt.

 

[Bent 00]

I want Snake to get the Cloaking device, plus one of these four taunts:

"Good", *Salute*, "Infinite Ammo", "You're Pretty Good".

 

[Neville]

Snake can cancel his Nair into specials, including his C4 sticky for one!

 

[BC]

Snake's got plenty of cool(and stupid) tricks. I haven't mastered any of them, but I can do them.

First one is what I like to call Cipher looping. It's a silly little thing where you cancel the first few frames of Cipher into a Dair, then repeat as fast as you can. If an opponent is on a platform directly above Snake when this starts, they'll start repeatedly taking 8 percent from the Cipher's hitbox. This is easily SDI'able, but it's still an easy 3-4 loops. You can even true combo 1 or 2 loops into an Utilt if your opponent screws up their SDI for an easy stock.

The other thing I've learned is that Snake can cancel any of his aerials into any of his specials. Examples include the first 2 hits of Nair into a guaranteed C4 stick, Fair canceled into Cipher into Uair(if you're really quick), first 2 hits of Dair cancelled into a Grenade or Missile, and plenty more.

So... yeah. Snake's pretty cool. XD

 

[Bent 00]

If you use Snake's Nikita (Side B) and hold A, he'll warp a Grenade to one of 3 (or was it 4...) locations in front of him, instead of firing a missile.

 

[Xentas]

The Cypher Cancel is one of the first things I learned about. I noted it in the post.

Longbow Grenades? (essentially Grenade Warp) Ah... Takes me back to Borderlands lol.

In comparison to the other Heavyweights, Snake can be pretty damn good. He's def A tier skill.

 

[player_03]

The grenade warp has four options: far in front, near in front, above, and below. Choose between them with the control stick.

Also, if Snake is holding an item, the item will warp to that location, rather than the grenade. You can use this to drop a motion sensor bomb near your enemy (you pull a motion sensor bomb by using neutral B three times in a row).

Finally, there's a bug feature that lets you both spawn a grenade and fire a missile. This is because the grenade spawns earlier than the missile. You need to hold A to spawn the grenade, then release it to spawn the missile. However, that isn't enough: you also need to hit the ground between those two events, which presumably tricks the game somehow. So here's the sequence:

1. Jump.
2. Press forward+B+A.
3. Spawn the grenade.
4. Land and release A (you can also release B at this point).
5. Fire the missile.

I assume this will be fixed in 4.0. It's your choice whether you want to abuse it in the meantime.

 

[Pin Clock]

Finally, there's a bug that lets you both spawn a grenade and fire a missile.

That is a feature

 

[player_03]

Ok then. Seems kind of obscure for a feature, but whatever.

I kind of wish you didn't have to release A to make it work. It should be enough to time the landing correctly. (The A button doesn't affect the endlag, does it?)

 

[Bent 00]

Finally, there's a bug feature that lets you both spawn a grenade and fire a missile. This is because the grenade spawns earlier than the missile. You need to hold A to spawn the grenade, then release it to spawn the missile. However, that isn't enough: you also need to hit the ground between those two events, which presumably tricks the game somehow. So here's the sequence:

1. Jump.
2. Press forward+B+A.
3. Spawn the grenade.
4. Land and release A (you can also release B at this point).
5. Fire the missile.

I've played Minus Snake many hours, but I didn't know about that feature. Thanks for sharing it!

 

[Mariosonicman1]

we defedently need a minus video on snake so we can better understand that move... cause im lightly confused on how its executed.

 

[player_03]

What happens when you try to do it? Do you get a grenade and no missile, or a missile and no grenade?

 

[AGentleStar]

First one is what I like to call Cipher looping. It's a silly little thing where you cancel the first few frames of Cipher into a Dair, then repeat as fast as you can. If an opponent is on a platform directly above Snake when this starts, they'll start repeatedly taking 8 percent from the Cipher's hitbox. This is easily SDI'able, but it's still an easy 3-4 loops. You can even true combo 1 or 2 loops into an Utilt if your opponent screws up their SDI for an easy stock.

The grenade warp has four options: far in front, near in front, above, and below. Choose between them with the control stick.

Also, if Snake is holding an item, the item will warp to that location, rather than the grenade. You can use this to drop a motion sensor bomb near your enemy (you pull a motion sensor bomb by using neutral B three times in a row).

Finally, there's a bug feature that lets you both spawn a grenade and fire a missile. This is because the grenade spawns earlier than the missile. You need to hold A to spawn the grenade, then release it to spawn the missile. However, that isn't enough: you also need to hit the ground between those two events, which presumably tricks the game somehow.

O_____O

I didn't realize Snake was more technical than Melee Samus. It makes me wonder why there aren't more people playing Minus competitively. This is the kind of technical skill and intricacies that many people wish they had in other games.

 

[Lucis Perficio]

Ok then. Seems kind of obscure for a feature, but whatever.

I kind of wish you didn't have to release A to make it work. It should be enough to time the landing correctly. (The A button doesn't affect the endlag, does it?)

This sounds like a case of Minus devs not fully updating changelogs (like with how Ike lost the ability to dodge sideways out of side-b despite teh changelog only saying that it was meant to disallow spot dodges, as well as the ability to connect specials out of QD on the ground, which was possible even without NSM and which Pin made it seem like would be corrected, yet two patches later this hasn't been addressed).

 

[player_03]

This sounds like a case of Minus devs not fully updating changelogs

Actually, it sounds like more of a case of this:

If it helps characters rather than hinder them, it is a feature.

...which certainly explains why it's so obscure. (Sadly, the same reasoning didn't apply here, though I guess that was a lot stronger than Snake spawning an extra explosive.)

 

[Lucis Perficio]

Actually, it sounds like more of a case of this:



...which certainly explains why it's so obscure. (Sadly, the same reasoning didn't apply here, though I guess that was a lot stronger than Snake spawning an extra explosive.)

What I'm referring to is the fact that there doesn't seem any specific place to learn about these things. The wiki and the changelogs seem to leave some things out as far as I can tell.

 

[player_03]

What I'm referring to is the fact that there doesn't seem any specific place to learn about these things. The wiki and the changelogs seem to leave some things out as far as I can tell.

Yeah, but I'm saying that Pin Clock probably didn't know about it until I pointed it out, so he couldn't have put it in a changelog.

 

[Lucis Perficio]

Yeah, but I'm saying that Pin Clock probably didn't know about it until I pointed it out, so he couldn't have put it in a changelog.

There is no way to objectively confirm or deny something like that although I can see it as a possibility. I also wasn't necessarily suggesting Pin do the updating, but that changelogs simply be kept up to date in general.

But I digress, I was wondering if Snake still had his super long DACUS from vBrawl and if that while performing this it would be possible for him to angle the uSmash for potentially wider spread mortars? Asking for a friend, since I don't play Snake myself.

 

[Pin Clock]

He can still do all those things

 

[AGentleStar]

Last I checked, doing the usual input of Ctrl Stick right -> Down Cstick -> Ctrl Stick up + Z will more often than not do a DACDS (Dash Attack Cancelled Down Smash). It's a crapshoot mostly.

 

[Lucis Perficio]

He can still do all those things

Excuse my potential redundancy but a sentence like that is easily misconstrued, particularly because one part of my statement refers to something Snake could do since vBrawl, and the other part refers to something which Minus added (anglable usmashes). Also, the lack of a direct quote like I usually see from ppl's replies on this forum adds to the ambiguity.

So Snake CAN in fact perform DACUS WHILE angling uSmash (this is a single thing I'm referring to, which further explains why "all those things" may be seen as confusing in response to what I said)? How practical is it to do so considering that both actions require the analog stick?

[Some find it annoying that I'm verbose but I hope that Minus mods can see that it's purely based in rationale for the sake of specificity.]

 

[fantasyDinosaur]

snake can perform a DACUS, but i don't believe that he can angle his mortars as they leave his uSmash. because Snake doesn't have to worry about angling his uSmash mortars and DACUS still covers a stupid amount of range, it's still extremely useful for stage control, especially since Snake shoots out three mortars instead of one.

 

[AGentleStar]

snake can perform a DACUS, but i don't believe that he can angle his mortars as they leave his uSmash. because Snake doesn't have to worry about angling his uSmash mortars and DACUS still covers a stupid amount of range, it's still extremely useful for stage control, especially since Snake shoots out three mortars instead of one.

How do you DACUS? What inputs do you use?